Curse

Takeko Nakano · Feb 14, 2009, 11:38 AM // 11:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkNecrid

So how is this any different from World of Warcraft being announced in 2001, having VERY little information released until late 2003/2004 when beta came out, then coming out in late 2004?

You really don't know the answer?

Because WoW did not have a player-base in a prequel prior to release of the sort that GW2 does at the moment from GW players. If it doesn't keep us interested, we're off. If we find something interesting to keep us going fewer of us will return for GW2. Also, if we leave and the community shrinks less new players will want to buy a game when they hear hardly anyone plays it anymore.

I think ANet have handled things terribly so far. They started a game which had follow-on campaigns that were a tad linear but still enjoyable and people bought. They then decided that they'd suddenly stop the campaigns and try to tide us over with a single expansion (plus some tiny content updates) until a whole new game came out.

Now I have to ask myself, did they honestly think we'd wait all that time for GW2, did they think they could have got it done faster, or they didn't care? I doubt the last for the reasons I gave in my second paragraph. If the first or second they were very foolish.

It would have been so much better to keep developing GW1 with proper releases and not stop development until they could see when a beta for GW2 would have been realistic - yes that would have delayed GW2, but who cares about a game we don't know will even be released? What they've done is to burn their bridges by stopping the campaigns and expansions for GW without having anything coming up in the near-future for the series. How stupid!

Xhizors · Feb 14, 2009, 11:38 AM // 11:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by agrios

Question is: how keep the masses entertained for a whole year without a new expansion or major content update?

not possible.

siadina · Feb 14, 2009, 11:40 AM // 11:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by furanshisuko

i think im the only 1 thats happy about this. it will give me enough time to finish my titles

Nope ur not the only one This is excellent news *mr.Barns hand rub* For those of us who came to the game later or though titles were a waste of time this gives us that changed our minds time to achive some of those lofty titles. I am worried about the ingame ecnomoy though.....but hey they will feed us tidbits of new stuff to keep us entertained i am sure. *Casue You Dont Really Love me, You Just Keep Me Hanging On*

Sia

maraxusofk · Feb 14, 2009, 11:58 AM // 11:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by siadina

Nope ur not the only one This is excellent news *mr.Barns hand rub* For those of us who came to the game later or though titles were a waste of time this gives us that changed our minds time to achive some of those lofty titles. I am worried about the ingame ecnomoy though.....but hey they will feed us tidbits of new stuff to keep us entertained i am sure. *Casue You Dont Really Love me, You Just Keep Me Hanging On*

Sia

quick question because im not a guru of pop culture references, but who exactly is mr. barns and why is his hand rub famous?

seut · Feb 14, 2009, 12:04 PM // 12:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Takeko Nakano

You really don't know the answer?

Because WoW did not have a player-base in a prequel prior to release of the sort that GW2 does at the moment from GW players. If it doesn't keep us interested, we're off. If we find something interesting to keep us going fewer of us will return for GW2. Also, if we leave and the community shrinks less new players will want to buy a game when they hear hardly anyone plays it anymore.

I think ANet have handled things terribly so far. They started a game which had follow-on campaigns that were a tad linear but still enjoyable and people bought. They then decided that they'd suddenly stop the campaigns and try to tide us over with a single expansion (plus some tiny content updates) until a whole new game came out.

Now I have to ask myself, did they honestly think we'd wait all that time for GW2, did they think they could have got it done faster, or they didn't care? I doubt the last for the reasons I gave in my second paragraph. If the first or second they were very foolish.

It would have been so much better to keep developing GW1 with proper releases and not stop development until they could see when a beta for GW2 would have been realistic - yes that would have delayed GW2, but who cares about a game we don't know will even be released? What they've done is to burn their bridges by stopping the campaigns and expansions for GW without having anything coming up in the near-future for the series. How stupid!

How many people are not going to buy Diablo3, because there were no reasonable patches for its predecessors for several years?
As for developing GW2 parallel to GW1: Anet doesn't have the manpower to do that and it would've resulted in campaigns even worse than EotN.

TalosFeld · Feb 14, 2009, 12:25 PM // 12:25

There's useally 3 years between announcement and actual release with any game, so it's very much plausible.

devils wraths · Feb 14, 2009, 12:40 PM // 12:40

an at this stage i think i will safely say we are going to see duke nukem forever before gw2. i brought this up because some mentioned the game earlier. an for your information if you wanna be a bitch its bene in development since about 2002 because they changed the engine quite a bit

these are in no order of posting they are from George's twitter who is the head of 3drealms http://twitter.com/georgeb3dr?page=1

Quote:

Packing up to go visit our publisher and show them the game and cool sh!t to get them hyped and excited. Cold and rainy day to fly.

Quote:

Looking at item interface on screen again. We're trying to finalize some core systems and polish them up.

Quote:

A peek inside our task database at some resolved issues http://twitpic.com/1fuju

Quote:

Working on hud impact and hit effects today. Been in a while but need polish and attention. These things really contribute to the "feel"

Quote:

Putting in some new main menu sound effects. Beefy sounding.

Quote:

while waiting for many gigs of data to xfer via USB. We need USB 3.0.

Takeko Nakano · Feb 14, 2009, 12:46 PM // 12:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by seut

How many people are not going to buy Diablo3, because there were no reasonable patches for its predecessors for several years?

I have no idea. But D2 was a game you could play by yourself even if you didn't have an internet connection - I guess D3 will be the same. GW is an online game that is very difficult to play by yourself - for the more elite areas anyway. Thus maintaining a community is very important for GW in a way it isn't for Diablo.

Quote:

As for developing GW2 parallel to GW1: Anet doesn't have the manpower to do that and it would've resulted in campaigns even worse than EotN.

You know ANet's employee structure, do you?

What we do know is that they had two teams at one point - they could have put one team on to GW2.

seut · Feb 14, 2009, 12:52 PM // 12:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Takeko Nakano

I have no idea. But D2 was a game you could play by yourself even if you didn't have an internet connection - I guess D3 will be the same. GW is an online game that is very difficult to play by yourself - for the more elite areas anyway. Thus maintaining a community is very important for GW in a way it isn't for Diablo.

The harder difficulty levels are usually played online and groups are necessary for the boss encounters.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Takeko Nakano

You know ANet's employee structure, do you?

What we do know is that they had two teams at one point - they could have put one team on to GW2.

I know that the quality of EotN was not as good as Anet can deliver, when they can completely concentrate on the product.

CHannum · Feb 14, 2009, 01:11 PM // 13:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skye Marin

t's okay if you don't play Guild Wars. If you want to take an extended break, that's fine. I really don't see anyone complaining that you can't move achievements over from Diablo II to Diablo III.

I beat Mass Effect in 12 hours, and played the same amount I did for Guild Wars, which I played for over 600 hours before Factions. I will gladly buy sequels for both. Lighten up a little.

Bingo. I don't understand all the bellyaching about how they'll never be able to entertain the whiners for another 1-2 years on the same game they already paid for 2 or more years ago already, and that somehow this will spell the end of GW.

When Diablo 3 ships, I'll buy it day one assuming my computer rig will play it even though I haven't touched a Diablo game since around 2004. When Starcraft 2 ships, I'll buy it day one assuming my computer rig will play it even though I haven't touched a Starcraft game since around 1999. If the Max Payne developers ever make a non-console sequel, I'd be there even though it's been something like 3 years since I touched either Max Payne 1 or 2.

With the *rare* exception of something like Everquest to Everquest 2, there are no game franchises that live or die on being capable of not disappointing the attention deficited generation. It's usually at least a year of downtime between game sequels, often more. Even something as presumably in permanent vapor ware status as Duke Nukem Forever would still find plenty of people willing to buy it if it ever shipped.

It's for damn sure I'll be there to pay for Guild Wars 2 even it doesn't ship until 2015. I've never gotten so many hours of gameplay for so little. I'm up to $140 dropped on the game - that would buy me, maybe 150 hours of gaming with my DS2, mabye 200-300 hours with typical PC titles, but with GW it's well over 1000 hours and counting.

Symeon · Feb 14, 2009, 01:15 PM // 13:15

Guild Wars development timeline:

March 2000: Triforge formed
~Q4 2000: Guild Wars development begins in earnest
December 2002: NCsoft Acquires ArenaNet
April 2003: Guild Wars announced
Q4 2004 - Q1 2005: World Preview Events
April 2005: Launch
(Dates taken from http://www.arenanet.com/press/)

5 years between the founding of ArenaNet and the launch of Guild Wars. Giving them up to a year to lay the foundations of their company, GW development could have begun in earnest as late as March 2001. A safe estimate would be that GW development took ~4.5 years (Q4 2000 - April 2005).

Here is a timeline for GW2 with the same development schedule as GW1 (except for the date it was announced):

April - Q4 2006: ArenaNet working on Chapter 4
Q4 2006: Chapter 4 cancelled/revised to EotN. GW2 development begins
March 2007: GW2 + EotN announced
August 2007: EotN released
Q3/Q4 2008: Originally projected GW2 beta
Q4 2006 + 4yrs = Q4 2010: GW2 beta
Q4 2006 + 4.5yrs = Q2 2011: GW2 launch

Now a few things to remember:

ANet was smaller during GW1 development
GW2 is most likely a larger, more ambitious project than GW1
With GW1 they were working pretty much from scratch, whereas GW2 has GW1 to work from.

1 and 2 cancel each other, so left with 3, we might assume that the GW2 development period will be slightly less than that of GW1. With this in mind, a 2010 release seems reasonable.

own age myname · Feb 14, 2009, 02:20 PM // 14:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Symeon

Guild Wars development timeline:

March 2000: Triforge formed
~Q4 2000: Guild Wars development begins in earnest
December 2002: NCsoft Acquires ArenaNet
April 2003: Guild Wars announced
Q4 2004 - Q1 2005: World Preview Events
April 2005: Launch
(Dates taken from http://www.arenanet.com/press/)

5 years between the founding of ArenaNet and the launch of Guild Wars. Giving them up to a year to lay the foundations of their company, GW development could have begun in earnest as late as March 2001. A safe estimate would be that GW development took ~4.5 years (Q4 2000 - April 2005).

Here is a timeline for GW2 with the same development schedule as GW1 (except for the date it was announced):

April - Q4 2006: ArenaNet working on Chapter 4
Q4 2006: Chapter 4 cancelled/revised to EotN. GW2 development begins
March 2007: GW2 + EotN announced
August 2007: EotN released
Q3/Q4 2008: Originally projected GW2 beta
Q4 2006 + 4yrs = Q4 2010: GW2 beta
Q4 2006 + 4.5yrs = Q2 2011: GW2 launch

Now a few things to remember:

ANet was smaller during GW1 development
GW2 is most likely a larger, more ambitious project than GW1
With GW1 they were working pretty much from scratch, whereas GW2 has GW1 to work from.

1 and 2 cancel each other, so left with 3, we might assume that the GW2 development period will be slightly less than that of GW1. With this in mind, a 2010 release seems reasonable.

Nice speculating, but for all we know GW2 could of been in development even farther back.

I said this in another thread and I'll say it again, and I quote:

Quote:

"I remember a friend of mine PMing me during the NF preview weekend awhile back. He said that a game called "GW2" was going to come out in the future, I said "Do you mean another expansion?" or something along the lines of that.

So for all we know it could of been in development BEFORE Nf was released...?"

faraaz · Feb 14, 2009, 03:15 PM // 15:15

Wow that is the most posts by Regina I have seen in any thread on Guru so far.

On topic: GW2's release date is ludicrous, and Anet is losing prospective buyers day by day, based on the falling levels of interest brought on by an interminable development process.

Get it out already! Otherwise, atleast give us screenshots, concept art, something!!

Faer · Feb 14, 2009, 04:00 PM // 16:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkNecrid

So how is this any different from World of Warcraft being announced in 2001, having VERY little information released until late 2003/2004 when beta came out, then coming out in late 2004?

Blizzard didn't leave their customers playing a single flawed game for years until they got a better one out (as has been proven over time, many Guild Wars players play the game as much as you would expect them to play a Pay2Play game, which was not what ArenaNet originally thought would happen, but has begun updating the game to attempt to accommodate). They had Diablo, Diablo 2, StarCraft, and Warcraft II/III (which all, even after many years, have strong player communities to this very day) for people to play and jump between while waiting for their new product. ArenaNet has Guild Wars, and as they have said themselves, they are not planning on releasing any more major content updates for the game. Online RPGs need major content updates to remain playable by anyone who doesn't have autism for more than a few years.

That is what makes this different. ArenaNet seems to expect people to wait patiently for GW2 based on their opinions of GW1. I don't see this plan working out too well. At this point, because they can not go back in time and unsay everything they have said, it might be in their best interest to just not say anything more about their mystery project, lest they make another mistake.

Aeon221 · Feb 14, 2009, 04:26 PM // 16:26

You folks do understand that this is a video game, not a relationship, right?

Anet has brand recognition, money, and time. In a few years, most of you will have either grown up or moved on from GW1, meaning less competition with their earlier product, and less short term ill will. GW2 will be a blockbuster.

In the mean time, try to refrain from cutting yourselves because you're all angsty about GW2 not being released RIGHT NOW. Soothe your deformed minds with Adderall or something.

HawkofStorms · Feb 14, 2009, 04:43 PM // 16:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by maraxusofk

quick question because im not a guru of pop culture references, but who exactly is mr. barns and why is his hand rub famous?

Pretty sure that was a typo for "Mr Burns" a well known Simpson's character.

"Excellent"

Edit: On topic. Don't give me this bull about how "they are losing customers by not keeping us informed." BS. You all know you are going to buy the game anyway when it gets released. You are all dedicated enough to visit a fan forum all the time. You will buy the game, and so will thousands of people who have never even heard of guru.

Stop... threatening (for lack of a better word) Regina to try to get her to release information. A.net's marketting department likely has a very tight control over everything she says, and they aren't going to change a long term business strategy just to please a bunch of people threatening to go on a hunger strike or whatever on a forum.

Mangione · Feb 14, 2009, 05:18 PM // 17:18

Well we have to wait, GW2 isn't the only videogame being produced in the world atm.
If I get tired of GW, I'll switch to something else.

But 'll buy with my eyes closed GW2 when it will be released, no matter if it is 2010, 2011, or 2020.

I liked GW a lot, so if GW2 has a tenth of the qualities of GW, I will still be more than satisfied with it.

CHannum · Feb 14, 2009, 05:41 PM // 17:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by agrios

Question is: how keep the masses entertained for a whole year without a new expansion or major content update?

Answer: you don't because you don't need to.

The masses do not generate additional revenue and, while it gets said again and again, apparently it needs repeating: there is more than enough content in the existing game to justify the cost. While this was true even if you purchased them at full price, this is particularly true now that new buyers can get all three full games for $50 or less via the new Trilogy edition. If you can make an argument that a new player won't get $50 worth of good playing the existing content then you either have never played any other games or should seek psychiatric help. This game only makes money through new sales, ergo, Anet's interest is in moving copies of the Trilogy edition for the next year and, ideally, let the grumpy whiner player base go somewhere else so they are not cutting into their profits. Anet's only goal with the existing customer base is to leave them feeling they got their money's worth so they will come back for GW2, nothing more. If the little bits of additional content, e.g. the EoTN Wintersday stuff this year, aren't rocking your world, go do something else.

It's not nearly as complicated as people make it out to be: if you have a game that has no subscription fee, the designers' interest is NOT to keep you playing 24/7, 365 days a year. Their goal will never be more than leaving you happy enough to buy a new expansion or sequel over or in addition to the competition. It's not inconceivable that many of the changes introduced the past year that anger so many old timers because they make things arguably easier are there to speed up the "get done and get out" for people still looking to hit GWAMM or whatever - "Psst, here's a bone to make the game more accessible to the new players we want to buy the game and turn their friends onto and, by the way, it will let you finish your legendary vanquisher title that much faster so you can GTFO and stop killing our profit margins"

Crunk N Monkey · Feb 14, 2009, 05:47 PM // 17:47

i like the word usage "hunger strike" it nails the overall feeling on the head. lol.

I cant see a late 2010 release for GW2, and the only reason i say that is because of the holiday season, its a great marketing pitch i know, but didnt they say they expect holiday events like in GW1? I dont think NCsoft and Anet would stretch themselves out with a brand new release and getting ready for both holidays event in GW1 and GW2. I do think that if the game is ready by 2010, it will most likely be released during the summer of 2010 or spring of 2011. I dont know what it was like when GW1 first came out, but im pretty sure there were several large updates that came out within the first couple months to fix certain glitches and bugs in the game along with content updates and what have you, i dont think they would stupid enough to do that while doing updates for Halloween and Wintersday and everything else, it makes more sense for them to release it afterwards, making the public wait another 3-4 months with the tagline "youve waited 3-4 years, you can wait 3-4 more months"

And i agree, Anet is losing interest from GW1, not GW2. If anything, more and more people are getting hyped up over GW2. I know i am.

You know, i thought just popped into my head. Im pretty sure alot of people would stay in GW1 for the next two years if Anet said they will only choose active people in GW1 for the beta testing for GW2.

IlikeGW · Feb 14, 2009, 06:26 PM // 18:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by CHannum

It's not nearly as complicated as people make it out to be: if you have a game that has no subscription fee, the designers' interest is NOT to keep you playing 24/7, 365 days a year.

No, if you market the game with no mention of subscription fees at all, then that's fair. If you market the game saying it's the future of MMO's and touting the no subscription fee, then it's misleading marketing to say "well we didn't really want people to play it much." Also these people come from Blizzard and they don't expect people to play games a lot? Really? And you believe them?